Subject: Re: FVWM: title-bar patch

From: [email-masked] (Martin Cartwright)
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 1996 19:02:22 +0100

=> From: Charles Hines <[email-masked]>
=> DK> (I'm one of those sad people who like the cosmetic aspects of fvwm2,
=> DK> vertical pixmaped titlebars, or better yet, the 'marbled' window
=> DK> effect seen at http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~s2154962/ are wonderful!)
=> 
=> Yeah, I may actually have to give in and add the title bar patch (or
=> something similiar) to fvwm proper, at least as a compile time option
=> (although I am loath to do those) with the volume of people raving
=> about the original patch & "Rasterman's" patches.
=> 

I see no reason to include it in any beta or official version. Provided
I can find someone who can either 
a) explain how to patch it in words of one syllable
or
b) do it for me (it always pays to be nice to the SysAdmin)
Then I'm happy with a patch. However, having gone to the extent of having a 
pixmap background for the title, then why not go the whole hog and have a 
textured window frame. If the demand really is there for inclusion in the
whole package then by all means, but don't put yourself out Chuck.
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---

From: "Charles Hines" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 1996 14:32:57 -0400

>>>>> "MC" == Martin Cartwright <[email-masked]> writes:

MC> => From: Charles Hines <[email-masked]>
MC> => DK> (I'm one of those sad people who like the cosmetic aspects of fvwm2,
MC> => DK> vertical pixmaped titlebars, or better yet, the 'marbled' window
MC> => DK> effect seen at http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~s2154962/ are wonderful!)
MC> =>
MC> => Yeah, I may actually have to give in and add the title bar patch (or
MC> => something similiar) to fvwm proper, at least as a compile time option
MC> => (although I am loath to do those) with the volume of people raving
MC> => about the original patch & "Rasterman's" patches.
MC> =>

MC> I see no reason to include it in any beta or official version. Provided
MC> I can find someone who can either
MC> a) explain how to patch it in words of one syllable
MC> or
MC> b) do it for me (it always pays to be nice to the SysAdmin)
MC> Then I'm happy with a patch.

Actually, what I meant is that if I do include it (which I think I am
going to for 2.1.0) then it won't be as a patch in the distribution,
but actually in the code officially.

MC> However, having gone to the extent of having a pixmap background
MC> for the title, then why not go the whole hog and have a textured
MC> window frame. If the demand really is there for inclusion in the
MC> whole package then by all means, but don't put yourself out Chuck.

I'm going to check out Rasterman's patches, just for grins, but I
don't think I'll include that just yet.  But perhaps if his additions
are simple, maybe I will add them as a compile time option as well.
Who knows?

Chuck

---

From: "William E. Roadcap" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 1996 09:18:36 -0400 (EDT)

> are simple, maybe I will add them as a compile time option as well.

I took a long long look at Rasterman's page.  Although I find his ideas to
be REALLY cool, 8 hours of looking at that desktop could give one a very
serious migraine headache.

I'm not saying that some of these feature shouldn't be added.  If these
are fairly small nonintrusive patches they should included.  They could
make for some VERY attractive desktops when used properly.

What I would _r e a l l y_  like to see:

-	Optional mini-pixmaps on the WindowList, and title bar
	or on the N/W title bar button.  This mini-icon would
	"follow" the application via a common FVWM style.  This has
	already been done well by the Fvwm95 team via 
	Style "whatever" Titleicon mini-icon.xpm
	Perhaps Hector P. could share a patch with us.

-	If the titlebar pixmap patch is not adopted, then at the
	least we should be able to set the titlebar (just the title
	button itself) to a different color that the rest of the 
	window frame.

-	The ability to NOT display geometry on the WindowList.
	Actually, the whole WindowList syntax needs to be made less
	cryptic.  Again, Fvwm95 has improved this and we could benefit
	from their work.  Here is an excerpt from the Fvwm95 man page
	regarding WindowList options.

              ShowAllDesks - All windows on all desktops 

              ShowCurrentDesk - Only windows on the current desk-
              top will be shown.

              ShowDesk  n - Only windows on desktop number n will
              be shown.

              ShowGeometry - When specified, the geometry of each
              window  will  be  added to the list. 

              UseWindowNames - The windows are listed  using  the
              window (titlebar) name. This is the default

              UseIconNames  -  The  window's  icon  names is used
              instead of the title name.

This is just my two cents.  Although I have tinkered with and contributed
code to Fvwm95, I'm no Win95 fan.  Nor am I really fond of the Win95
(Where in hell did the frames go?!?) look. I'm sure many of you share this
sentiment.  However, that doesn't mean that we can't benefit from some of
the useful and attractive ideas of others.  Not everything in the Win95
interface is bogus.  Even the taskbar itself is a good idea, especially
when in autohide mode.  It's just a horizontal FvwmWinList with a few
amenities, right?  If you think about it, we did it first.  So, let's sue
MS. ;-)   Just kidding....

__
William E. Roadcap                            mailto:[email-masked]
TITUS Software                                   ftp://titus.cfw.com/pub
Waynesboro, Va (USA)                            http://www.cfw.com/~roadcapw

---

From: [email-masked] (Albrecht Kadlec)
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 96 16:07:07 +0200

>>>>> William E Roadcap writes:

> are simple, maybe I will add them as a compile time option as well.

W> I took a long long look at Rasterman's page.  Although I find his ideas to
W> be REALLY cool, 8 hours of looking at that desktop could give one a very
W> serious migraine headache.

I probably wouldn't use the rxvt-background for long, considering HUGE
pixmaps (spell: slow redraw?) & near unreadable text.
I do like the marble decorations, though. (I could live without, but ..)

W> I'm not saying that some of these feature shouldn't be added.  If these
W> are fairly small nonintrusive patches they should included.  They could
W> make for some VERY attractive desktops when used properly.
I guess andrew's workin on it, and I vote for inclusion of his patches.

W> What I would _r e a l l y_  like to see:

W> -	Optional mini-pixmaps on the WindowList, and title bar
W> 	or on the N/W title bar button.  This mini-icon would
W> 	"follow" the application via a common FVWM style.  This has
W> 	already been done well by the Fvwm95 team via 
W> 	Style "whatever" Titleicon mini-icon.xpm
W> 	Perhaps Hector P. could share a patch with us.
somewhat cryptic, but sth like that should be considered.
(maybe I'll lokk at it, since I'm into windowlist by now)
any other windowlist ideas?

W> -	If the titlebar pixmap patch is not adopted, then at the
W> 	least we should be able to set the titlebar (just the title
W> 	button itself) to a different color that the rest of the 
W> 	window frame.
I vote vor adoption. It's not that big, is it?
We could gain more by code-cleanups & better orthogonality of features.
(i.e: the windowlist is a menu as well, so solve the mini-icon stuff for
menus in general, but in a way windowlist can use it, and the windowlist
mini-icons are free. I think _that_ patch would be included immediately.)

W> -	The ability to NOT display geometry on the WindowList.
W> 	Actually, the whole WindowList syntax needs to be made less
W> 	cryptic.  Again, Fvwm95 has improved this and we could benefit
W> 	from their work.  Here is an excerpt from the Fvwm95 man page
W> 	regarding WindowList options.

has been done. (I mailed a patch to chuck, actually it contained some more
changes. You'll probably see them in 2.1.0)

I'd suggest more people "put their money where their mouth is" (from
rec.ww) and not only discuss changes, but send chuck diffs.

W> This is just my two cents.  Although I have tinkered with and contributed
W> code to Fvwm95, I'm no Win95 fan.  Nor am I really fond of the Win95
W> (Where in hell did the frames go?!?) look. I'm sure many of you share this
W> sentiment.  However, that doesn't mean that we can't benefit from some of
W> the useful and attractive ideas of others.  Not everything in the Win95
W> interface is bogus.  Even the taskbar itself is a good idea, especially
W> when in autohide mode.  It's just a horizontal FvwmWinList with a few
W> amenities, right?  If you think about it, we did it first.  So, let's sue
W> MS. ;-)   Just kidding....

albrecht
-- 
You can own everything you see
Sell your soul for complete control
Is that really what you need	-- Pink Floyd
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---

From: Don Mahurin <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 20 Sep 1996 06:33:58 -0400

>         Perhaps Hector P. could share a patch with us.

Renamed to 'Style MiniIcons' of course, since They are not always on the
title bar.(They could go in WinList,FvwmWinList, TaskBar?

I have the FvwmWinList MiniIcon patch(The one in Fvwm95), for when
someone adds the MiniIcon Style.

>         button itself) to a different color that the rest of the

Hmmm, Blue? I see where you are headed.

> (Where in hell did the frames go?!?) look. I'm sure many of you share this

I dont mind the look of Fvwm95.  I would rather see that look as options
so I can mix and match what I like.  This will most likely happen in
Fvwm2.

> when in autohide mode.  It's just a horizontal FvwmWinList with a few

Maybe.  If It grew to show All Icons, not Xt..., Wt..., then It would be
useful(like FvwmWinList)

---

From: Brady Montz <[email-masked]>
Date: 20 Sep 1996 12:22:36 -0700

> someone adds the MiniIcon Style.

FvwmIconMan would be ready to go as well.

-- 
 Brady Montz
 [email-masked]