Subject: FVWM: Re: blanking screen for a long time (fwd)

From: Todd Fries <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 10:42:08 -0600 (CST)

Forwarded message:
> Date: Mon, 06 Nov 1995 15:41:35 +0100 (MET)
> From: [email-masked]
> Subject: FVWM: Re: blanking screen for a long time
> Sender: [email-masked]
> > > One more question I am wondering about:  When you start up fvwm,
> > > does your screen go blank (except for the mouse pointer) for a few
> > > seconds before everything comes back up with window decorations etc.???
> > Not noticeably when I start, but it does when I restart. It's not for
> > long though, only about a second.
> When I restart it's even longer.  Sometimes up to 10 seconds.
> Very strange.
> 
> I am sending a copy of this to the Mailing List.  Maybe someone
> else has experienced this, too.  Or maybe someone even knows a
> work around.

I have compiled 1.3.34-38 on my pc (linux) and on a sun at school.  This 
is definately a behavior of Fvwm.  I commented on this in a recent mailing
to the list; maybe no one picked up on it.

Anyway, I find it quite annoying...Before, using version 1.23...when I
started X in Linux, I would get:

1) screen flash as the video card was probed
2) 'checkered' X background with the mouse pointer in the center
3) the background would be cleared if I ran 'xsetroot'...as fvwm started up..

Now, currently, I get:

1) screen flash as the video card was probed
2) 'checkered' X background with the mouse pointer in the center
3) the background is quicly cleared to black
4) the background in step 2 is re-drawn painstakingly slow, as if being loaded
   from swap (I have 8 mb ram)
5) the background would be cleared if I ran 'xsetroot'...as fvwm started up..

Is there a reason for steps 3 and 4?  I know they are a behavior of the recent
versions of fvwm, but as I asked earlier, why?

BTW, for what its worth, step 4 doesn't happen on the Suns, I don't know why..
nor when I export it to the sgi's or the rs6000 we have that can't compile
X apps...

It used to be that when one restarted fvwm, the apps would, one by one, get
their boarders 'removed' and then a pause and then one by one they'd get
boarders once more.  Now, the whole screen goes black, and everything must 
re-fresh itself as it gesta  boarder...

WHY?
-- 
<a href=mailto:[email-masked]>Todd T. Fries</a>
<a href=http://www.cs.umr.edu/~tfries/>My Homepage!</a>
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---

From: <[email-masked]> (Charles Hines)
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 12:01:47 -0500

>>>>> "Todd" == Todd Fries <[email-masked]> writes:

Todd> It used to be that when one restarted fvwm, the apps would, one
Todd> by one, get their boarders 'removed' and then a pause and then
Todd> one by one they'd get boarders once more.  Now, the whole screen
Todd> goes black, and everything must re-fresh itself as it gesta
Todd> boarder...

Todd> WHY?

Rob added some calls to black out the screen during window captures so
you wouldn't have to see all that happening.  I'm going to make it an
optional feature, I think, since I like to know that fvwm is actually
doing something during this blackout...

Chuck

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 1995 02:41:28 +0900

chuck_hines> Rob added some calls to black out the screen during
chuck_hines> window captures so you wouldn't have to see all that
chuck_hines> happening.

I think the "blackout while fvwm starts" feature is for avoiding
"unpredictable focus problem when fvwm starts up", i.e., when fvwm
starts, focus to nowhere (equal "focus to NoFocusWin"). But only Rob
knows the fact...

- -
Makoto 'MAR_kun' MATSUSHITA
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From: <[email-masked]> (Charles Hines)
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 13:11:23 -0500

>>>>> "Matsushita-san" == matusita  <[email-masked]> writes:

Matsushita-san> I think the "blackout while fvwm starts" feature is
Matsushita-san> for avoiding "unpredictable focus problem when fvwm
Matsushita-san> starts up", i.e., when fvwm starts, focus to nowhere
Matsushita-san> (equal "focus to NoFocusWin"). But only Rob knows the
Matsushita-san> fact...

Actually, I think he did it for purely cosmetic reasons.  That window
that comes up obscuring everything else is never actually touched by
the window manager itself.  The NoFocus window is another window
entirely.

Chuck

---

From: [email-masked] (Robert Nation 885-9815)
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 95 13:22:45 EST

>doing something during this blackout...

Actually, I thought that this would make things happen more quickly/smoothly.
While fvwm is adding borders, it keeps raising and lowering and
reparenting windows, which means that they get lots of expose events,
and they redraw a lot, many times unnecessarily, because they soon get
hidden again. I thought that the single black window covering everything would
keep these windows from getting unneede expose events, and minimize redraws.

Rob

---

From: <[email-masked]> (Charles Hines)
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 13:30:18 -0500

>>>>> "Rob" == Robert Nation 885-9815 <[email-masked]> writes:

>> doing something during this blackout...

Rob> Actually, I thought that this would make things happen more
Rob> quickly/smoothly.  While fvwm is adding borders, it keeps raising
Rob> and lowering and reparenting windows, which means that they get
Rob> lots of expose events, and they redraw a lot, many times
Rob> unnecessarily, because they soon get hidden again. I thought that
Rob> the single black window covering everything would keep these
Rob> windows from getting unneede expose events, and minimize redraws.

Ah...  That makes sense.

Chuck

---

From: Austin Donnelly <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 22:05:54 +0000 (GMT)

> Rob> windows from getting unneede expose events, and minimize redraws.

Cunning idea!

How about this for the TODO list:

 * The colour could be made a configuration option.

 * A small (again, configurable) string (default: "Please wait...") be
   put up ?

 * That Rob's explanation be put in the FAQ. I'd always wondered why
   the screen went black.

Cheers,
Austin

---

From: [email-masked] (Robert Nation 885-9815)
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 95 13:42:01 EST

>> Rob>I thought that

Note that, if people find that the black intro screen is slowing things
down, then it is a mis-feature, and should just be removed. Also, if you
make the intro screen highly configurable, then it will take a while to read in
the options on how to display it, and it may become ineffective (or may
become even more irritating, depending on your perspective.)

Rob

---

From: Peter Funk <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 07:50:05 +0100 (MEZ)

Robert Nation 885-9815 wrote:
rn> >> Rob>I thought that
rn> >> Rob> the single black window covering everything would keep these
rn> >> Rob> windows from getting unneede expose events, and minimize redraws.
rn> >
rn> >Cunning idea!
rn> 
rn> Note that, if people find that the black intro screen is slowing things
rn> down, then it is a mis-feature, and should just be removed. Also, if you
rn> make the intro screen highly configurable, then it will take a while to read in
rn> the options on how to display it, and it may become ineffective (or may
rn> become even more irritating, depending on your perspective.)

I'm a very satisfied user of fvwm 1.24r for long time now and I've 
never noticed any screen blanking caused by fvwm.  My machine
is a stock Pentium-90 PC.  So I don't think, it might be too fast to notice
the dicussed effect.  

So I wonder whether the discussed feature has been added to fvwm
after the 1.24r release.

Regards, Peter
-=-=-
Peter Funk, Oldenburger Str.86, D-27777 Ganderkesee, Germany
office: +49 421 2041925 (ArtCom GmbH, Grazer Str.8, D-28359 Bremen)
echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln256%Pln256/snlbx]sb3135071790101768542287578439snlbxq'|dc
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From: Andy (Flognat) Eskilsson <[email-masked]>
Date: 09 Nov 1995 12:53:49 +0100

/ Peter Funk <[email-masked]> wrote:
| 
| So I wonder whether the discussed feature has been added to fvwm
| after the 1.24r release.
| 

Don't know if youve heard this before.. but it is a (I think) new
feature for 2.0 or something the like :-) So you probably haven't
seen it..

	/andy

---

From: <[email-masked]> (Charles Hines)
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 08:55:26 -0500

>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Funk <[email-masked]> writes:

rn> Note that, if people find that the black intro screen is slowing
rn> things down, then it is a mis-feature, and should just be
rn> removed. Also, if you make the intro screen highly configurable,
rn> then it will take a while to read in the options on how to display
rn> it, and it may become ineffective (or may become even more
rn> irritating, depending on your perspective.)

Peter> I'm a very satisfied user of fvwm 1.24r for long time now and
Peter> I've never noticed any screen blanking caused by fvwm.  My
Peter> machine is a stock Pentium-90 PC.  So I don't think, it might
Peter> be too fast to notice the dicussed effect.

No, actually the reason you don't notice it is because it's a 2.xx
only feature.

Peter> So I wonder whether the discussed feature has been added to
Peter> fvwm after the 1.24r release.

Yup - see above.  It may be removed shortly though, since even though
it may speed things up a little, I think that it is giving the
appearance of starting up slowly.

Perhaps I'll make it conditionally compiled in or controlled by a new
command line option instead.

Chuck